Episode 113: JFK - Roger Stone's "The Man Who Killed Kennedy: The Case Against LBJ"

Roger Stone seems to say, "Jack and Bobby were spoiled brats, but LBJ was a raging psycho." 

Here's the thing: When we focus on LBJ and push the narrative that he must have been the "mastermind" of JFK's murder, we're not looking at the bigger systems of power. The kinds of institutions that are way above a POTUS or a VP. 

Just sayin' ... 

Links:

https://www.amazon.com/Man-Who-Killed-Kennedy-Against/dp/1626363137

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Stone

https://www.kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-articles/241

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/i-was-raped-by-mountbatten-in-kincora-at-age-11-he-wasnt-a-lord...-to-me-he-was-king-of-the-paedophiles/a/118175160.html

Episode 94: JFK - What do we think of Madeleine Duncan Brown? https://www.buzzsprout.com/2289560/episodes/14230306

Episode 78: JFK - Where was Poppy on November 22, 1963? https://www.buzzsprout.com/2289560/episodes/14259939

Episode 32: JFK - Noam Chomsky Said the Quiet Part Out Loud 😮 https://www.buzzsprout.com/2289560/episodes/14393320

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My award-winning biography of Dag is available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Decoding-Unicorn-New-Look-Hammarskj%C3%B6ld-ebook/dp/B0DSCS5PZT

My forthcoming project, Simply Dag, will be available in hardback, paperback, ebook, and audiobook formats on July 29th! 

Transcript

Transcription by Otter.ai.  Please forgive any typos!

Sara Causey discusses Roger Stone's book "The Man Who Killed Kennedy: The Case Against LBJ," examining Stone's claims about LBJ's role in JFK's assassination. Causey expresses skepticism, noting Stone's personal biases and the potential for ghostwriting. She highlights Stone's portrayal of LBJ as a manipulative figure and his use of sources like Judith Campbell Exner and Madeleine Duncan Brown. Causey also references Stone's connections to Roy Cohn and the intelligence agencies, questioning the extent of LBJ's involvement. She concludes that while LBJ may have benefited from JFK's death, she remains unconvinced he was the mastermind.

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Roger Stone, LBJ, JFK assassination, conspiracy theories, biography, ghostwriting, Kennedy family, Lyndon Johnson, political intrigue, intelligence agencies, Nixon, Roy Cohn, Clint Murchison, Charlie India Alpha, Watergate.

Welcome to con-sara-cy theories. Are you ready to ask questions you shouldn't and find information you're not supposed to know? Well, you're in the right place. Here is your host, Sara Causey.

Hello, hello, and thanks for tuning in. In tonight's episode, I will be talking about Roger Stone's book, the man who killed Kennedy, the case against LBJ. I was also able to find a copy of Stephen kinser's book. All the Shaw's men, very relevant, very germane to the times in which we're living in now, given the USA and Israel versus Iran, I want to make sure that I read that book and then I'm able to digest it and get a podcast episode up about it next month. So stay tuned for that. But in the meantime, tonight, let's open up this book that Roger Stone has written where he points the finger at LBJ, and assess, is this trustworthy information, or does Roger Stone have his own agenda? A point to ponder.

Just a reminder, Sara's award winning biography of Dag Hammarskjold, Decoding the Unicorn is available on Amazon. Her next nonfiction project, Simply Dag, will release on July 29th. To learn more about her other works, please visit SaraCausey.com. Now back to the show.

To not bury the thesis of this episode, it really seems to me that Roger Stone's main argument is something like this. I didn't really like Jack or Bobby Kennedy. I didn't have much use for them. I thought that they were spoiled brat playboys who womanized their way through town everywhere they went, and they weren't anything special. But I completely and utterly hated LBJ. I felt like LBJ was a complete psychopath, a sociopath, a liar, a manipulator of the highest order, so I'm more than happy to finger him for the murder of Jack Kennedy. I'm like, okay, all right, but I come back to something that I've said before, and it's I feel that it's even truer for me now, having written biographies plural, I have decoding the unicorn that's already out. I have simply dag that will be out on July 29 of this year. You don't spend that kind of time, energy, effort and money with somebody that you hate. So whenever I encounter these biographers who act like, Oh well, I started out liking so and so, but then when I started doing research for the biography, I realized that this person was a sack of crap. Okay, well, then why did you write a biography about them? Because it's not freaking easy. I know that if you're independent, it costs a lot of money, and even if you're traditionally published, you still have to spend a lot of your own time, energy and money promoting it. See, everybody thinks that if you get a traditional publishing deal, that they're going to roll out the red carpet for you, and it's like, okay, if you are Harry and Megan, Michelle Obama, Stephen King, JK Rowling, somebody who already has a pedigree and they know that they're going to make a crap load of book sales, then, yeah, sure, they roll out the red carpet for you. But for the rest of us, those of us down here, not in the rarefied air, they don't do that. So the idea of spending all of that energy, that money, that time, to talk about a topic that you hate, to talk about a person that you hate, it just doesn't ring true for me. And here's another facet of that argument, because the book very clearly says Roger Stone with Mike cola Pietro, a famous person might have their name on the book. And to be clear, I'm not saying that this is true of Roger Stone, because I don't know him and I don't know what the backstory is here. I'm painting with a broad brush. Sometimes. What happens with these famous people. In fact, I would say probably 98 to 99% of the time with some famous person that comes out with an autobiography, a memoir, a novel, whatever it's been ghost written. I actually got pinged not that long ago by somebody that was like, Hey, we have these clients that are willing to pay in the six figures for a ghost writer. Are you interested? And I'm like, No, I'm not, because, yeah, we need money to live on planet Earth. Don't get me wrong. But money is not everything. It's important. You know, if you're standing there and you need to pay your light bill, you're like, shit. I need some cash. I'm not going to sit here and lie and say that money is meaningless. What I am saying is that money is not everything, and I'm not interested in ghost writing some crap for some vapid celebrity. Let somebody else do that. So I think sometimes what happens again? Now I'm not saying that this is the case with Roger, because I don't know, but sometimes what happens when a famous person or a known personality drops a book, whether it's about somebody that they supposedly love, that somebody they hate, it's about themselves. They haven't really spent the time to do it. They don't ultimately give a shit, because it's not their work. Their name is attached to it, and they get to trot out like a show pony in the press and be like, Oh, look at my best selling book. I'm a best selling author now, but they don't have any real investment in it. So in other words, if somebody is going to write a hit piece, or they're going to come out with some book about Well, I started out liking John Doe, but now I hate his guts, and I decided to go ahead and write an 1100 page biography about him. Anyway, more than likely, they didn't write it themselves. They had a ghost writer or a team of ghost writers doing that for them. So then, in fact, they weren't spending time on a subject that they hated. They weren't spending time going deep into the life of somebody who they came to loathe. A hired hand was paid to do that for them. And I just get super suspicious whenever somebody comes out with a hit piece and they're like, Oh, I started out like this, but then I ended up like that, right of course. Now, in Rogers case, as I mentioned, it seems to be that he doesn't have much use for the Kennedys. He does say at the beginning of the book that he was raised Catholic, and that even though his parents voted for Nixon, they were proud that a Catholic had become President of the United States. He's at least complimentary enough to say that, but generally speaking, in the book, it's like, I don't have any use for the Kennedy family. I don't have any use for Jack and Bobby but if you're looking for the ultimate snake in the grass like the worst baddie that you can possibly imagine, it was LBJ and so let me write this giant book to tell you all about what a sack of crap Lyndon Johnson was. I don't, to be clear, have some opposition to that, because I'm not a fan of LBJ. I personally don't think that LBJ was the entire mastermind of the Kennedy Pop Pop. Did he benefit from it? Of course. Does that mean he planned all of it single handedly. No, it doesn't. When we focus on LBJ and we say it must have just only been him, it cheapens the whole affair, in my opinion. And I do, at some point, plan to review bar McClellan's book. You know, I've talked about the men who killed Kennedy Docu series, and that last incendiary episode that was all about LBJ, when we focus on him, and we focus on him so myopically, as if to say he was the mastermind. He did this. It was all him. He was the ultimate baddie. You're taking the heat away from the intelligence agencies. You're taking the heat away from all of the other factors, all of the other individuals that would have had to have been complicit in what happened. You're just saying, Nope. LBJ was the mastermind, and he was the vice president of the US. It's not like he had no power at all. It was him. He did it. He just concocted it. You know, he had a history of political murders, and so it was him. Case closed. The Warren Commission report was a bunch of doo, doo poo, poo bullshit. But it's okay, ultimately, because we don't have to worry about the Charlie India alpha. We don't have to worry about the fox trot Bravo India. We have to worry about any kind of intelligence or military industrial complex. No, it was strictly Johnson.

And I'm just sitting here like I don't believe that, and I want to own up to it, whether you are a frequent tuner inner or this is the first broadcast of mine that you're listening to. I just want to be clear about that bias on my part, I don't think LBJ was the mastermind. I think he benefited from it, yes, but I don't think that he single handedly engineered all of it alone. I think back also to the Clint Murchison house party, and the more that you hear it, the more that somebody tells the story, it gets embellished to the point where it's like, Finally, that night at Clint murchison's house, you're going to have Cleopatra, Alexander, the great emperor Nero, anybody you can think of was there at this house party. And it's like, yeah. The more that I hear about this alleged house party, the more I wonder if the whole thing was made up. Every bit of it. So nevertheless, let us move forward. Now that I've said all of that, let's move forward. If you're not familiar with Roger Stone, let's hop over for a moment to his Wikipedia page. That's a that's a good place to just get some very basic information. Roger Stone is an American right wing political activist, consultant and lobbyist. He is a prominent consultant and lobbyist within the new right and the orange man's longest serving political advisor. He was the subject of widespread media coverage for the Mueller special counsel investigation and his alleged involvement with and connections to Russian interference in the 2016 US presidential election. Since the 1970s stone has worked on Republican campaigns, including those of Nixon Reagan, Kemp dole, Poppy, no excuse me, not Poppy, the other 1w, son of poppy and the Orange Man. He co founded a lobbying firm with Paul Manafort and Charles R black Jr. The firm became black Manafort stone and Kelly or B, M, S, K, in 1984 now that became a top lobbying firm, leveraging White House connections for high paying clients, including us, corporations, trade associations and foreign governments. Stone's style has been described as a renowned in fighter, a seasoned practitioner of hard edged politics, a Republican strategist and a political fixer. Stone has called himself an agent provocateur. He has described his political modus operandi as Attack, attack, attack. Never defend and admit nothing, deny everything and launch a counter attack, all evocative of associate Roy Cohn. End quote. Roy Cohn, of course, was the prosecutor during the Rosenberg case, and he was also Joseph McCarthy's Chief Counsel during the army McCarthy hearings in 1954 he's considered to have been one of the orange man's business mentors early in his career. So if you're not familiar with these individuals like Roger Stone and Roy Cohn, this gives you an idea of their basic playbook in the book, Roger Stone quotes freely from people like Judith Campbell Exner and Madeline Duncan Brown, neither of whom would I personally trust, as far as I could throw them. If you have not read James di eugenio's essay about the posthumous pop pop of JFK, I will drop a link to it in the write up for this podcast episode, especially if you're new to the broadcast or maybe you're new to JFK research, you absolutely owe it to yourself to read that article, because there are a number of these people that have come forward about oh JFK and his supposed mafia ties. Oh JFK and all these mistresses. Oh he was sleeping with this one and that one. And James di Eugenio goes through and really examines their stories like, do any of these stories hold up under the slightest bit of scrutiny, or is it a matter of any lady who comes forward and says, Oh, yeah, we were banging each other is automatically believed, even if there's no evidence whatsoever that they were in the same room with each other. Like, what's going on here? So that's one point where I'm like, if you're freely quoting people like Judith Campbell Exner and Madeleine Duncan brown. You know, Brown was supposedly lbjs long term mistress, and maybe she was, I don't know, maybe they were knocking boots every time he came through town. But she tells the story about the Clint Murchison house party, and every time she would talk about her supposed phone call with Lyndon, it changed just a little bit. Oh, those goddamn Kennedys will never do this to me, those MF and Kennedys. And it's like, well, which was it if he called you up on the phone and told you something negative about the Kennedys and then Jack Kennedy gets popped? Wouldn't you remember that? I would think for me, that would be burned into my memory in the preface before we ever even really get to the meat and potatoes of the work Roger Stone tells us that JFK was a habitual user of injectable amphetamines. There's a book called Dr feel good that makes the case that Kennedy was being injected by a celebrity doctor named Max Jacobson, and he was given a highly addictive liquid mixture of meth and steroids. Therefore JFK must have been hopped up on meth during the presidential debates with Richard Nixon during the Cuban Missile Crisis, during the Bay of Pigs invasion, and presumably during his many sexual trysts. JFK also arranged for Dr Jacobson to inject First Lady Jacqueline Kennedy meth and steroids affect mood and judgment. Wow. I may at some point. Point do some episodes around the Netflix series the crown, I would just have to really think about how I want to handle that, or if I want to just take certain components of events discussed in those episodes and go into them separately. I don't know. For example, Lord Mountbatten is one of the characters in the show, and he was popped in 79 by the IRA. There was a story in the Belfast Telegraph from just this past December, and the story was, I was essayed by Mount batten in kinkora at age 11. He wasn't a lord to me, he was the king of the PDF files. The byline reads veteran journalist Chris Moore interviewed three victims of the senior royal killed by the IRA in 1979 for his new book on the most enduring child scandal in the history of the UK. He says the story won't go away, despite a huge establishment cover up. I mean, wow, you know somebody with that kind of proximity to the royal family. And then also we have to think about Jimmy Sara what was going on with him for years and years that got swept under the rug. Also, there's a scene bringing this back to JFK. There's a method to my madness here, bringing this back to JFK. There's a scene in one of the episodes where exactly this type of thing, this doctor, feel good. Type of thing is going on with Jack and Jackie. And it really like whoever they cast. I don't even know who the actors were, but whoever they cast doesn't look anything like JFK. Doesn't look anything like Jackie, but Jackie is almost like a bird, like a sad, confused bird that has no mind of her own, and we see Jack man handling her, being domestically abusive to her, physically abusive to her essaying her and forcing her to take drugs. And I'm like, Whoa, this is serious. What the fuck material. So we haven't even gotten out of the preface, and we're already like, Well, Jack Kennedy was an old drug head, and he was hopped up on meth during some of the most perilous crises of the Cold War. Okay, thanks, Roger. In the introduction, he describes an alleged conversation with Richard Nixon, where Nixon says it's a hell of a thing. I actually knew this Jack Ruby fellow, Murray chopner, brought him in back in 47 he went by the name Rubenstein, an informant. Murray said he was one of lbjs Boys, and we put him on the payroll. He also talks about Marcello. He says that Marcello pulled the strings of Jack Ruby, and he was allied with Tampa mob boss Santo trafficante. He mentions Lamar waldron's book Watergate, The Hidden History. And he says trafficante and Marcello would funnel $500,000 in secret campaign contributions to Richard Nixon in 1960 to stop the federal prosecution of Teamsters President Jimmy Hoffa. I have mentioned that kind of thing before. It's like one of the rumors is that both candidates were taking money from the mob, just kind of dependent on which strain of the mafia you're talking about. So it's sort of like, is, is there any high ground to stand on here? However, I will also point out to you that James di Eugenio talks about that accusation as well in his article about the posthumous pop pop of JFK, and he's like, who, who was it that the mafia was supposedly getting the vote for? Were they in West Virginia trying to bribe squirrels to vote for JFK? Or what was actually happening here? It's a it's a legitimate question, if we really want to distill the book down into one paragraph. Here it is, and this is again, from the introduction. Johnson was a man of great ambitions and enormous greed, both of which in 1963 would threaten to destroy him. In the end, LBJ would use power from his personal connections in Texas, from the underworld and from the government, including elements of the Charlie India Alpha organized crime and right wing Texas oil men desperate to retain the oil depletion allowance, which JFK wanted to repeal, to escape an untimely end in politics and to seize even greater power. LBJ was the driving force behind a conspiracy to pop, pop. JFK on November 22 1963 there are places in the book where I almost felt like my eyes were crossing, because it feels a little bit like Roger Stone just jabber jawing and name dropping. Oh, I met so and so in 1974 and I was. Here, and then we went and had dinner there. And I guess if you've ever felt like, Roger Stone would be a cool dude to just go and have a Scotch with like, Wouldn't it be amazing to go to a bar have it, have some whiskey with him, and just listen to him bloviate for two hours. You might love this book, but for me, I was like, just give me the evidence, man. Because truth can come from anywhere. It can come from somebody you don't like. It can come from somebody that's on the opposite side of the political fence. It can come from somebody that you think is goofy. So to me, it was like, just, just give me the evidence. Man, I don't need to know that you went on vacation with such and so, and you were big friends with this guy. And that guy, just give me some info. He describes LBJ as being vicious, mean spirited, vengeful, aggressive, arrogant, abusive, sex crazed. He talks about lbjs sexual habits all of his different lovers. He also tells a scatological story about LBJ sitting on the toilet and going to the bathroom in front of people or taking his penis out to urinate in front of female journalists or female staff members, especially if he was down on his ranch in Texas. Okay, that's that's probably true. He doesn't exactly, to me, seemed like he was well bred and Genteel. But how does this relate to the Pop Pop? There's a chapter called landslide Linden, where he talks about how the 13th precinct would be the focus of the box 13 election fraud in lbjs, 1948, senatorial bid. In a nutshell, the box 13 scandal involved Jim wells County in Texas during that 1948 US Senate election, and it was between Coke Stevenson and LBJ, and it seemed that coke Stephenson was really going to be a shoe in but as the story goes, LBJ made sure that the election was rigged in his favor. In chapter four, which is titled nemesis, he talks about how LBJ absolutely detested Bobby Kennedy, and there was this sense that if something difficult or unseemly had to be done as part of the Kennedy family business, I'm using air quotes here that Kennedy family business. Bobby was the one sent to deal with it. Roger Stone also quotes pretty freely from Seymour Hersh is book The Dark Side of Camelot. So that's another thing that gives me pause where I'm like, Hmm, what? What's actually going on here? He has a chapter as well on J Edgar Hoover, and the idea that Hoover felt like his days might be numbered, and that if Kennedy came into office, that he would probably want to clean house, and that would include getting rid of him. Allegedly, LBJ said of J Edgar Hoover that he'd rather have him inside the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in. So the notion is that LBJ felt like it would be better to make J Edgar Hoover an ally. Like the idea of the enemy, of my enemy is my friend, that sort of thing. Like, if I know that Hoover hates JFK and I hate JFK, then we can form an alliance. In the chapter 1000 pieces, there's something he writes that I think is worthwhile. It's like, okay, we could actually get something from this. The Charlie India Alpha attempted to shape John Kennedy's cold war strategies. When that tactic had failed, the agency formed its own strategy independent of the President's wishes, with the approval of NSC 10 dash two in 1948 by President Harry Truman's National Security Council, permission was given to the agency to carry out propaganda, economic warfare, preventive direct action, including sabotage, anti sabotage, demolition and evacuation measures, subversion against hostile states, including assistance to underground resistance movements, guerrillas and refugee liberation camps. Or excuse me, refugee liberation groups. Secretary of State George Marshall warned President Truman, before the Act was passed, that the command would endow the Charlie India alpha to be almost limitless. The Act expanded the scope of operations so that the agency could carry out and grant the agency. Wait a minute. Sorry, I'm having a slightly dyslexic moment. The Act expanded the scope of operations that the Charlie India alpha could carry out, and granted the agency autonomy, operations could now be so planned and executed that any US government responsibility for them is not evident to unauthorized persons, and that if uncovered. The US government can plausibly deny any responsibility for them the Charlie India Alpha was a conspiracy unto itself. End quote, yes, I believe every bit of that to be true. Stone says that JFK feigned compliance with the Charlie India alpha to get elected, and then it pretty much stopped with the Bay of Pigs invasion, the botched Bay of Pigs invasion. Arthur Schlesinger has said that there was the goal that there be a 20% reduction in the Charlie India alpha and its budget by 1966 he gets into another story about Barry Goldwater, and allegedly, Barry Goldwater said to someone that he was very comfortable with his belief that LBJ was behind the murder of JFK. He repeats the Judith Campbell Exner story of supposed blackmail going on, where messages were being passed between Sam Giancana and JFK, using her as the sort of mule. I don't know how much of that that I would even almost believe, but Roger Stone puts it in the book, and essentially he promotes the message, or the idea that JFK was knowingly taking mob money and just thinking that whenever I get elected, I don't need them anymore. I'll use their money to get where I want to get, and then after I'm elected, I don't have to deal with the mob anymore. And I think this ties in with LBJ, because part of the thesis is look at this collection of enemies that LBJ had that he could use as allies because they didn't like JFK, or they didn't like the Kennedy family in general.

To that point, Roger Stone tells a story. On the appointed morning I arrived at cones. This is referring to Roy Cohn. I arrived at Cohn's law firm Brownstone on the Upper East Side. I cooled my heels for about an hour. Finally, I was told to go to a second floor dining room where Mr. Cone would meet me. He was wearing a silk dressing gown. His heavy lidded eyes were bloodshot, most likely from a late night of revelry. Seated with cone was his lawyer, a heavy set gentleman who had been meeting with cone Meet Tony Salerno, said, Roy I was face to face with Fat Tony Salerno, at that time, the boss of the Genovese crime family in October 1986 Fortune magazine would call the 75 year old Salerno, America's top gangster in power, wealth and influence. So there's that who knew? Who knew that Fortune magazine had a list of, you know, the up and coming, the the big shots of the gangster world. Wow, I guess so much for your 4040, under 40, so much for your 30. Under 30. Don't you want to be known by Fortune magazine as the top gangster in power, wealth and influence? Salerno served as consigliere under boss and acting boss of the Genovese crime family. Roy says we are going with Reagan, and that's all right by me, said Tony Salerno said he had eschewed presidential politics since 1960 when Jack Kennedy took our money and our votes and then fucked us. I couldn't resist who really killed? JFK, I asked Fat Tony, it was Carlos and LBJ the gangster replied, he got what was coming to him. Cone simply nodded his head to affirm salerno's claim, and they both laughed. That's of course, meaning Carlos Marcello. He also talks a bit about Bobby Baker. In 1963 there was an investigation by the Senate Rules Committee on Bobby Baker, his business, what he was doing politically. There were accusations of bribery, that Bobby Baker was essentially bribing members of Congress and arranging sexual favors in exchange for votes going the way that he wanted, government contracts going the way that he wanted. And Bobby Baker resigned as secretary to the majority leader in October of 1963 now allegedly, LBJ was not involved in any business dealings that Bobby Baker had after 1960 but there was still an investigation to look into things that happened back in the 1950s and this sparked the rumor that JFK was going to drop LBJ from the ticket in 1964 the idea that Bobby Baker was going down, LBJ was going down, there was going to be this big scandal, and so better to just get him off the ticket. He talks also about lbjs association with Billy Sol Estes. He was accused of perpetrating fraud through agricultural contracts, grain storage contracts, things of that, an ammonia anhydrous ammonia business. I don't understand all the ins and outs of that, but just suffice it to say for now, he was involved in fraud. In fact, he was convicted of fraud charges and served some years in prison for it. I. There have been allegations that LBJ was involved in the Kennedy pop pop, and some of that has come from Billy Saul Estes. And I guess Billy Saul even said that, like he was willing to blow the whistle on some things. But then there's kind of this, like, well, who can we can like, can we even trust this guy? Can you trust a liar to tell the truth? Can you trust a fraudster to tell the truth? He talks a bit about George de mourn shield, and asks the major question that so many have asked, Why is this urbane, educated guy running around with Lee Harvey Oswald? And then also, what actually happened to George de warenshield, because it's made to look like he unalived himself, but there's evidence that he did not unalive himself that was done for him. He also mentions the reporter, Dorothy Kilgallen, who died under very strange circumstances. I need to really do some separate episodes about Dorothy kilgallon, because allegedly she had some information that was going to shed light on the Kennedy pop pop, and then suddenly she comes up dead. Under bizarre circumstances, a reporter interviewed Jack Ruby, and Ruby says, When I mentioned Adelaide Stevenson, if he were vice president, there would never have been a pop of our beloved president, Kennedy. The reporter says, Would you explain that again? And Ruby says, Well, the answer is the man in office now, which was a reference to LBJ. Chapter 17 of the book is titled Poppy, and it is all about what was going on with poppy Bush, the day of the Pop. Pop, I have talked about that in another episode. I'll drop a link to it in case you missed it, but it is very odd the way that the scenario plays out, the way that he sort of set up a bizarre alibi for himself, like, what? What was actually going on with poppy and then the memo about George Bush being part of the Charlie India Alpha. Oh, but supposedly, it wasn't that George Bush. It was another George Bush who turned out to be like a janitor or something completely low level that had nothing to do with anybody that would have possibly been debriefed about the Kennedy Pop Pop. He also discusses Arlen Specter and the magic bullet theory. You know that the bullet Zig zagged around the car like a bumble bee and supposedly caused all these wounds in both Kennedy and Connally. To his credit, he also mentions that lecture where Noam Chomsky was like, Who knows and who cares? Plenty of people get killed all the time. What does it matter if one of them happened to be JFK, there wasn't a conspiracy. It could have just been a jealous husband or the mafia, but it just doesn't matter. I recorded an episode about that comment as well. I'll drop a link to it in the write up. The YouTube video that I linked to has since been taken down, but I'm sure if you're enterprising, you can still find it nearing the end of the book, Roger Stone writes, it is important to ask why, when looking into the Kennedy pop, pop, why did John and Bobby Kennedy, after living a privileged life, raised by a father who knew how the game was played, suddenly, when power was acquired, attempt to change the game. This question leads to significant events, the firing of Dulles, the crusade against organized crime, the attempt to unseat and neutralize Hoover the attempt to dismantle the Charlie India alpha, the initiatives taken against the oil depletion allowance, the pursuit of unseating Vice President Johnson through the multiple charges brought against him. Why care about a murder that happened 50 years ago? The Kennedy Pop. Pop goes hand in hand with the popular distrust of the government that sprung up in the late 1960s the pop pop of Kennedy dug the foundation of distrust the lies that landed us in Vietnam War and the Watergate break in cemented it. In order to win back the trust of the people, it is the government's responsibility to come clean. End, quote, you're not going to get the whole truth. I'm sorry. I don't believe it. If that sounds cynical, I apologize, but that's how I really feel you're not going to get the whole truth. I think that you're going to get limited hangouts and modified limited Hangouts. And I think we've also seen that with the tefree tepstein files, there are redactions, there are things that the public is never going to see, the things that we have been allowed to see about cannibalism and SA and sex trafficking and all of that. It's like, God, it's just so disgusting. And it's like the Internet has collectively said, Yeah, it's like all the conspiracy theorists, they were right the whole time. Pizzagate wasn't fake, like all this stuff was actually happening. Oh, well, huh. What are you going to do about it? Nothing. And I think of Bill Hicks, go back to sleep America, turn on American Gladiators and eat your pizza and go back to sleep because your government is in charge and they're handling it. Nobody's going to do anything. And I would love to have somebody who is more of an expert than myself. You. To come on and talk about exactly what's in like to summarize for us, for for this audience, what has actually been found in the Jeffrey tepstein files. That's something that I'm working on and that I would be very interested in, because I don't claim to be an expert on Jeffrey tepstein Or what all is in the files. I just know that what I have read and what I have heard about has been absolutely disgusting, but we're not going to get, in my opinion, the full truth of what happened to JFK, maybe centuries from now, decades from now, maybe, probably not in my lifetime, but maybe, maybe way down the road, you'll have some file dump, or you'll have somebody that comes forward and says, yeah, it totally was the agency. Guys, what are you going to do about it? Nothing. And that could happen. I just I don't really see it happening in my lifetime, but it could happen at some point down the road. In the end, I have to say that Roger Stone's book, the man who killed Kennedy, the case against LBJ, did not convince me that LBJ was the mastermind, a part of it, sure, someone who benefited from it, absolutely, someone who had advanced knowledge of it. What Jim Mars discovered in the LBJ Library about the memo that happened before Kennedy was murdered, that Johnson already knew he was going to be in charge and was going to start reversing Vietnam War policies. That certainly speaks to him, knowing what was going to happen before it happened.

But was he the mastermind?

I'm just not convinced. I feel like that's just more of the shiny object syndrome, and it's funny that I just covered Wag the Dog last week, because that's what it feels like to me, like in that movie, the President is in a sex scandal, but, oh, look over here. We're at war with Albania, and you should care about that. Now, an old shoe got left behind enemy lines, and so you should take your sneakers and throw them up in the trees for solidarity. And then everybody forgets the story about the girl that got essayed by the President in the movie. Even watching the movie, you forget about it, because everything is so distracting and entertaining and crazy that to me, is what the LBJ thesis feels like. Look over here at lying Linden, because if you're looking at him, you're not looking at everything else. Read the book. Look at what Roger has to say for yourself and form your own conclusion. As always, stay a little bit crazy, and I will see you in the next episode.

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